Intellectuelle

Sarah, Sarah... this is what happens when we get specific in our definitions;) I don't know whether to cluck my tongue or slap my leg.

Personally I would make a different list in defining how I think of "the Church Lady", and I've used this term for a stereotype, myself. This is a good way for us to see how very subjective such things are, how informed by our own experiences.... and a good look as well at how Christian women give certain perceptions ( or have them)

What interests me, and is probably due to our different way of life, is how strongly you weight the stay at home mom- who seems to be homeschooling. She is certainly a fundamentalist and maybe a Baptist, or maybe gravitated to the Reformed camp.

One thing that I get out of this personally is how hard we can be on one another. And that is one quality I think I would have on my own list of defining the Church Lady... that harsh rigidity that gives little grace and asks none.

Ilona - I actually think that I was quite generous (and not very harsh) to many by not forcing them into my "church lady box." Appearance really didn't enter in to my analysis and I have total respect for women in all capacities of calling. For example, my criticism is not directed toward the stay at home mom, rather it's directed at the stay at home mom who thinks that's the only legitimate calling for a Christian woman. And the reason I mention her is because you don't see Christian business women arguing that there profession is the only legitimate calling for Christian women.

I'm sure I'll be writing more on this soon, but I'm very happy to interact on this further. As well, if anyone finds me analysis inappropriate or fallacious, I'm interested in responding to you.

:)

I don't think your analysis is either inappropriate or fallacious, but it is subjective.

"you don't see Christian business women arguing that there profession is the only legitimate calling for Christian women."

You are right that professional women won't argue over the idea that only their profession is the "legitimate calling". I have found, however, that they are disdainful about the stay-at-home choice and see it as a waste of talent, reserved for those who are "unable or unwilling to do better". This is in the culture, including the Christian one- I wrote a fisk called "the Mommy Wars" on a Salon article voicing it.

You come from one side of the spectrum of experience and I come from the other- representing differing views which don't cancel each other out, but stand as two perspectives of the same phenomenon.

While we are on this part of the topic I'd like to say on the behalf of the SAHM who evangelises her position: it is often in response to an almost overwhelming pressure of the cultures challenge that only women who work count and a belittling of their choice ...Which was the case not so very long ago. Someone is told how stupid they are only so many times before it begets a little abrasiveness in how the position is reiterated . I think that is what happened with many SAHM's.

The Church Lady Syndrome is one of harshness and forcing a cultural mold on others, along with the quality of hypocrisy, - not simply passionately arguing a side of the debate. I think that needs to be noted. We can all slide into this on occasion. As I've thought about it, the whole thing is not about convictions at all, but about the modus operandi.

Wow! The Church Lady sounds like the beginning of a good blonde joke! My observation is that far to many Christians define themselves by the role the play in life, not by the relation they bear to God. Therefore, you have the SAHM, the professional Christian woman, the wife of a Christian leader or the single professional woman. All are roles; and directed or not by God are not what defines a person but rather describes a person’s activities. We who are followers of Jesus are defined by that relationship as His own, His precious possession, His children. Our roles, which change through the course of our lives, are extensions of who we are in Him. The Church Lady as, described by Sarah, is deficient in several obvious ways, but most compelling in the example is her lack of love. My guess is this lack of love is the result of many years of having to justify a role that is no longer valued (as Ilona noted). But that does not excuse the attitude, because Jesus commands love. So, too, the professional woman, the single woman, the childless woman, is to love.
We should all discuss, examine and alter our attitudes and thoughts as directed by scripture, and respect the differences allowed by God. There is not one mold, one role for women. Each woman, no matter her station in life, is called to listen to God as He speaks and directs through His Word by the power of His Spirit. The Church Lady has no excuse for not reading her bible, and thinking and meditating on it and growing. The “God said it, I believe it, that settles it” mind set is a shallow, fearful excuse for belief. However, not everyone is a scholar with the inclination to read and study, so that cannot be the only defined way of growing in faith, a fact, I suspect we will all agree on.
The Church Lady lives a cloistered life, far from the world out there, but she, for all her fears of the world still must contend with her own flesh, her own sin nature and that is where we all live.
The war within may be contained at times, but clearly shows up in our fears and the ways in which we address them. Limits we put on ourselves to remain pure or undefiled seem simply to change the focus from our own sin to the sin “out there, in the world.” We are only fooling our- selves.
By definition, no Church Lady would be reading this, which is regrettable. But, I am challenged to love those women around me, Church Lady and all who are not in the same station of life as me. While I cannot change anyone’s mind, I can show the love of God and try to set an example. Scripture gives many examples of leading by example with love, which we do well to follow. For I fear we will all miss out if we neglect those who are not exactly in agreement with us about the role we play. The richness I have found in times with women in all stations of life has served to enlarge my view of the great creativity of God and the wideness of His grace.

well said, Barbara. Love *is* the determining factor in whether one is a "Church lady" or not. I think the stereotype has been there, but in our pop culture it is SNL that was the biggest factor in defining how we now think of the term. We all recognize something of the stereotype in our church relations, however.

I am curious, in your efforts to be an example of love in your congregation, is that recognized for its value of the desired role for women? do you ever find yourself at loggerheads with the "Church lady" persona? I just wonder.

Although I want to tell you that I think in the long run, your attitude and actions will win you the respect of all true Christians.

I think that when we see the reality of truth and love acted out we find ourselves attracted to it like a magnet to metal.

Thank you for the kind words. The church I attend is in a rural area, in a rural state. My husband is the pastor and has been for some years now. I had consciously fought the “pastor’s wife” stereotype and been fairly successful. All that being said, when women have attended who have the woman’s role all set in concrete, they have found the atmosphere of the church not to be conducive to that line of thinking. Every adult who attends for any length of time is encouraged to develop a relationship with Jesus in real time. Stereotypes and expectations based solely on tradition are rejected outright. The teaching and expectation is for all to be gracious in the gray areas of scripture. When I have run into some who want to hold me to their understanding, I have come to realize that trying to please them is useless; but continuing to interact, if even on a superficial level, is good, for both of us. Every woman, no matter how she understands her role and her relationship with God, is a sister. And while we may not be dear, dear sisters, we are sisters none the less.