When it comes to citing famous quotations, a good rule of thumb is to attribute any unknown saying to Shakespeare, the Bible, or Winston Churchill. Since Churchill's eloquence and wit is second only to that great proverb maker Anonymous, one is generally on safe ground by claiming him as the original source. Most people won't know any better anyway.
Alas, one particular quote that is often mistakenly attributed to the great Brit is,
Any man who is under 30, and is not a liberal, has no heart; and any man who is over 30, and is not a conservative, has no brains.
While the sentiment is certainly astute, the saying did not originate with Churchill. In fact, that wording is a variation of, "The man who is not a socialist at twenty has no heart, but if he is still a socialist at forty he has no head", which belongs to the former French Prime Minister Aristide Briand, who was himself a recovered socialist.
Briand, however, appears to have cribbed the saying from another French statesman, Francois Guizot (1787-1874), who originally said, "Not to be a republican at twenty is proof of want of heart; to be one at thirty is proof of want of head."
Naturally, the term Republican had a different meaning in Guizot's day and was not synonymous with "wise governance" as it is today. Liberals, however, may prefer Guizot version to all the others.
Huh. All these years...
I never liked that one. I became a conservative when I was 21, so the implication is I guess that I have no heart. But I find conservatism to be far kinder than liberalism.
The version I heard is:
A young man is a fool if he is not a liberal; an old man is a fool if he is not a conservative,
which boils the sentiment down to a clear contrast with fewest words into parable form (note the parallel construction really stands out), but retains the sentiment.
I forget the atribution.
Don't forget the also-prolific quipper Ben Franklin: he gets a lot of credit for things he didn't actually pen, as well. This one is not very Franlkinesque, though.
Um, P.S.—
Can't find the comments thread in which the topic of a nasty regular commenter being banned, so I'll thow my two cents in here:
I've been loathe to post (or even read the comments threads) for quite some time because of the constant rancor and difficulty in furthering a rational discourse there, particularly the harranging from the now-banned commenter. I support the decision to exclude him from the conversation in order to create an atmosphere where more civil discussion can take place. Who knows, I just might wade into the water again. Good move, Joe.
What I am really interested in is the veracity of all of those Lady Astor quotes from Sir Winston. My favorite -
Winston asks Lady Astor if she would sleep with him for a million pounds. She thinks for a moment and says "yes, maybe for a million pounds I would."
Winston replies "would you sleep with me for 10 pounds?" Lady Astor is quite taken aback and says "What kind of woman do you think I am?"
To which Winston replies - "we've already established what kind of woman you are, right now we're just haggling over the price."
I don't know if it's true, but it sure is funny.
And sorry for getting a bit off track from the discussion Joe.
They also get the quotations wrong. Here's one attributed to Franklin. Jack of all trades, master of none. The correct quote is Jack of all trades, master of one.
Naturally, the term Republican had a different meaning in Guizot's day and was not synonymous with "wise governance" as it is today.
Hahahahahahahahahaha... funniest thing here in a while.
David Wayne:
I believe it was George Bernard Shaw who made the famous quip about "haggling over price."
How's this one from Churchill?
Lady Astor to Sir Winston: "Sir, if you were my husband I'd poison your tea."
Sir Winston to Lady Astor: "Madam, if you were my wife I'd drink it."
That's my favorite.
Shaw was a clever fellow. He is credited with the following exchange with the beautiful dancer Isadora Duncan. The dancer suggested the possibility of she and Shaw producing a child together: "Think of it!" she said, "With your brains and my body, what a wonder it would be." Shaw thought for a moment and replied, "Yes, but what if it had my body and your brains?"
Ouch!
Of course, it has come to light that Hillary Clinton was a Goldwater gal way back when in the early sixties. That means she started out with no heart, has since become a liberal, and now has no mind. All that's left is pure ambition, which drives her to fake both heart and mind. She just isn't as good at it as her husband. "Ah don't feel nooo ways tarred."
There must be someone who feels embarrassed for supporting this woman or her husband.
I'm not embarrassed by my support of the Clintons, but I am embarrassed by my former support for Reagan. As a young man, I was a conservative. As I began to be turned off by the narrow-mindedness so prevalent among Republicans, I became a Libertarian. As I realized the futility and impotence of that perspective I became a full-blown liberal. I don't see myself as lacking in intellect for that change. Just because I grew a heart, it doesn't follow that my brain has atrophied.
"Naturally, the term Republican had a different meaning in Guizot's day and was not synonymous with "wise governance" as it is today."
This gets funnier every time I read it. Apparently, starting stupid wars, offending most of the world's population, increasing the rancor and division among the citizenry, and spending like a drunken Democrat is now considered "wise governance". It bolstered my faith in the American people last fall when they rejected that assessment. I truly hope that Republicans haven't learned that lesson, so that the fall of '08 will make the victory complete.
Rob Ryan wrote:
I don't see myself as lacking in intellect for that change. Just because I grew a heart, it doesn't follow that my brain has atrophied.
I suppose you're right, but not getting that "wise governance" was tongue-in-cheek leaves some doubt as to the development of certain parts of your brain.
In your defense, though, I would add that the comments of the rest of your fellow travelers show they didn't get it, either.
You would be quite a rare bird in your move from conservative to liberal. The point of the various quotes in Joe's post is that it's normal to go from living on emotion to tempering emotion with the mind. I would add that the baby-boomers represented emotions on steroids and there has been, therefore, a commensurate sea-change from liberal to conservative in the country at large. I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of those who've changed from one to the other have gone from liberal to conservative.
Yeah, you and Hillary are two lonely peas in a pod. And I still can't believe you aren't embarrassed by supporting her or her "big creep" husband.
jd, with his usual alacrity, said: "I suppose you're right, but not getting that "wise governance" was tongue-in-cheek leaves some doubt as to the development of certain parts of your brain."
The comment may have been "tongue-in-cheek", as you put it, but Joe must feel it has some basis in truth; otherwise, this place wouldn't seem so much like the cyber-media wing of the GOP.
There's actually a name for this phenomenon - it was dubbed the "Matthew Effect" by a sociologist named Robert Merton, who applied it to the world of science. The name "Matthew effect", of course, refers to the parable of the talents in the Gospel of Matthew.